Re: If you're honest, GOK, you'll concede -- here's conclusive proof you're wrong
Re: If you're honest, GOK, you'll concede -- here's conclusive proof you're wrong -- Jim	Top of thread		Forum

Posted by: godonlyknows ® 10/26/2004, 20:55:30 Author Profile Edit Alert Moderators

Jim, if you are honest you'll concede that in the same passage to which you refer, from which you simplistically infer that for Maharaji "there's no difference at all" between these concepts - "God", "Guru", "Lord" - you'll concede that Maharaji also says: "If I go to God: 'God, please!' 'What do you want?' 'I want wealth.' 'Okay, take wealth!' 'God, please god!' 'Yes, what do you want?' 'I want so much wealth.' 'Okay, take wealth!' But if I want to go to Guru, if I go to Guru and beg Him, He says, 'Okay, take God!' That's why he said that if you go to God, He will give you some wealth and some ordinary pleasures, but if you go to Guru, He will Himself give you God." If you are honest, Jim, you'll concede that Maharaji clearly IS making a distinction between "God" and "Guru" in that part of the same passage to which you refer. And also in the passages to which I have previously referred. But even from the evidence of that passage to which you yourself refer, I think it's clear that you are wrong to simplistically say that "for him at least, there's no difference at all". Rawat is simply speaking English here, as you say, but remember he is speaking English as a second language at a very young age, and speaking at times about some extremely complex concepts. My point is that these terms "God", "Lord" and "Guru" are not simple concepts at all. If "Guru" is simply "God", and "God" is simply "Guru", and they are literally the same thing, then how could Guru be "bigger than God" - as Maharaji is also reported to have said in that passage? How could God be bigger than God? If "God is great, but greater is Guru" - that familiar expression - then how could "Guru" BE "God", in any simplistic sense? How could God be greater than God? It doesn't make logical sense, does it? For every time that Maharaji may have suggested that "Guru" is "God", he has suggested many many more times that there is a distinction between "Guru" and "God". The reason I "have such a hard time getting to this point" is that I am having a hard time trying to make you realise that these concepts - "God", "Guru", "Lord" - are not simple synonyms, and they are not the easily-understood unproblematic concepts which you are simplistically asserting that they are, but they are actually very complex concepts. I am patiently waiting for you to accept this point.

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Now you're starting to piss me off --- Jim ( Tue, Oct 26, 2004, 21:04:50 ) ( 831 bytes ) +1 Re: Now you're starting to piss me off too --- #9 ( Wed, Oct 27, 2004, 18:01:22 ) ( 4656 bytes ) link You're just dodging a bullet --- Jerry ( Wed, Oct 27, 2004, 11:48:38 ) ( 850 bytes ) Re: If you're honest, GOK, you'll concede -- here's conclusive proof you're w... --- toby ( Wed, Oct 27, 2004, 13:03:17 ) ( 722 bytes ) +1 Re: If you're honest, GOK, you'll concede -- here's conclusive proof you're w... --- godonlyknows ( Wed, Oct 27, 2004, 21:43:08 ) ( 4604 bytes ) +5 Don't mean to barge in, but --- Jerry ( Wed, Oct 27, 2004, 22:12:12 ) ( 984 bytes ) Thanks for your answer, GOK --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 00:14:51 ) ( 664 bytes ) +1 Also, GOK -- two more things --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 08:07:31 ) ( 1280 bytes ) +1 gosh, ex-premie, oops former follower nostalgia --- Susan ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:30:10 ) ( 1117 bytes ) +1 Yes -- and let me comment on Dog and Mel Bourne --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:57:03 ) ( 1618 bytes ) +1 POWERFUL POSTS YOU TWO. MUST READ! - am I shouting? - YES! (no text) --- cq ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 14:31:17 ) ( 0 bytes ) Re: If you're honest, GOK, you'll concede -- here's conclusive proof you're w... --- toby ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 00:23:32 ) ( 1352 bytes ) +1 Really, Toby? --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 01:00:51 ) ( 284 bytes ) +1 Re: Really, Toby? --- toby ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 01:31:47 ) ( 1144 bytes ) +3 Lack of Love - more hypocrisy --- nemesis ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 09:11:28 ) ( 395 bytes ) here's the link to that post --- cq ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 12:07:21 ) ( 0 bytes ) link +1 Re: here's the link to that post --- cq ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:48:52 ) ( 236 bytes ) Re: Really, Toby? --- PatD ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 16:30:31 ) ( 1011 bytes ) Third post is a charm --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 09:30:07 ) ( 1513 bytes ) +2 Re: Maybe that's not a great example --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:06:37 ) ( 2529 bytes ) +2 You're not saying anything, do you realize that? --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:39:42 ) ( 1562 bytes ) +1 Re: no point reminding you of the many questions that you've avoided --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 20:43:37 ) ( 541 bytes ) +1 Oh, am I BORING you now? LOL!!!! --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 21:02:57 ) ( 683 bytes ) +2 ***funniest line ever typed on the forum*** --- Susan ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 21:10:14 ) ( 243 bytes ) funny!!! --- dant ( Fri, Oct 29, 2004, 08:06:42 ) ( 32 bytes ) +1 Re: funny!!! --- Jim ( Fri, Oct 29, 2004, 16:11:15 ) ( 139 bytes ) link Consider this, GOK. If you will ... --- cq ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 14:07:50 ) ( 2203 bytes ) +1 Re: "a true teacher " --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 20:31:21 ) ( 1682 bytes ) +2 ******WARNING - SATSANG - TALK ABOUT 'BORING'!****** --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 21:08:37 ) ( 50 bytes ) Oh My Gawd!!! Rawat never told you to feel Gratitude?? LOL!... --- Cynthia ( Fri, Oct 29, 2004, 07:12:45 ) ( 1948 bytes ) link Is that why Gok asked us if we were ex-premies? --- Susan ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:08:20 ) ( 17 bytes ) +1 Re: Is that why Gok asked us if we were ex-premies? --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:14:56 ) ( 27 bytes ) +1 hey Gok --- Susan ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:38:38 ) ( 111 bytes ) This is precious, GOK... --- Cynthia ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 10:01:33 ) ( 2035 bytes ) +1 Re: literal definitions --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 13:13:19 ) ( 267 bytes ) +1 What are you saying? That Maharaji is your God? --- cq ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 15:28:51 ) ( 279 bytes ) +1 Re: What are you saying? That Maharaji is your God? --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 19:36:00 ) ( 731 bytes ) +2 The Satguru --- PatD ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 20:12:26 ) ( 322 bytes ) +1 Re: gift of the gab --- godonlyknows ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 20:54:01 ) ( 843 bytes ) +1 Re: gift of the gab --- PatD ( Fri, Oct 29, 2004, 19:18:18 ) ( 956 bytes ) GOK, you're really being ridiculous now -- in a few ways --- Jim ( Thu, Oct 28, 2004, 20:56:57 ) ( 3750 bytes )