Well, I take that as a personal insult Jim! I do not think and speak like a premie, thank you very much! If you had heard half of what I have over the last year or two, may be you'd think differently. And I wonder how often you talk to premies these days. Do you see and talk to them day to day, like I do? I've heard enough from them recently to know that I sound nothing like them - but I don't get into arguments with them either. 'Cos they're my friends. I also do not get into arguments with any friends I have who are christian, atheist, buddist, muslim, whatever. Since I came across EPO, and gave M the sack, (that is, I fired him), I really began to "hear" what premies say. Of course I can see myself in there too, but my old self. Okay, I admit that my analogy was maybe not so good, but hold your horses there. I was just trying to convey the idea that it's not always so black/white, right/wrong - that it's too complex for that. And to give Glen a bit of slack. May be I should put my feelings of loyalty aside when reading here, but I came to Glen's defence when the posts about him seemed to become relentless. May be the words "back off" were too strong - and I would apologise to Joe and Thorin for that. Especially as I really enjoy reading their posts - always interesting and very intelligent.