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Posted by:
Inis ®

11/27/2017, 09:34:15
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Maybe a useless thought...
But, what a pity there is no rewind button.
All those years spent in stupidity. Thinking I was doing the right thing.
Hanging around this inflated jerk. 

I know I know...it is useless to think that way. Still I am allowed to regret I did not spend all those years around smarter people, doing more intelligent things.
Guess was not too smart myself. 
I am being offensive some may think now. Not a good way to make friends.
Thats ok. I have a right to think we were a bunch not too bright. Unfortunately locked in a huge pile of BS. 










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I know I have similar feelings
Re: No rewind button -- Inis Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
Susan ®

11/27/2017, 10:24:14
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I think you are stating something many of us feel. I hesitate to tell people that I was once in a cult because I think most see it as a sign of being stupid and gullible. The especially hard fact is the vast majority of people had no trouble seeing Prem Rawat/Maharaji as a scam artist and saying so. So then, um, why us? Right? My stepfather brought me to Satsang the first time, and I was 13– that helps me excuse myself a little. But I can attest that I tried to satsang lots of people my age and most would have nothing to do with it and were revolted. The couple friends who actually got involved I feel great regret about to this day- 

I don’t know if something was wrong with us. What were our shared vulnerabilities? I do believe, and there is lots of literature on cults to support this, that the need it met isn’t the same for each person. For me, I know I liked the sense of community, I liked the hugs and smiles and love I got. I liked belonging. The appeal of having a framework of someone else telling me the rules for living in our very scary confusing world was an appeal.

Maybe the most important thing I have to say here is that this website has washed away most of that shame. I have been reading this site almost daily far longer than I was a premie. I respect the intelligence, insights, and kindness of most of the people here. I may be ashamed to admit I was ever a premie but I am quite proud to keep the company of this group of ex premies.







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Re: I know I have similar feelings
Re: I know I have similar feelings -- Susan Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
Inis ®

11/27/2017, 11:12:07
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There is also anger.
Not just at Rawat.
At myself too. 
At the whole " congregation "
And it is allright too. I mean the anger. I feel now that if it comes up, I dont have to talk myself out of it.
I did disapppoint myself to some degree.
It may sound strange but I also think this feeling has value. 
Sure Rawat is an asshole and it was / is a scam and all that.
Yet I also played into it.
And then who am I to judge people who fell into nazism etc...
Whatever my reasons, the reasons, I experienced something like that. Played into it. Without wondering. 

yet I still find it disgusting when I see people sucked into it. Or other similar stuff. Like I know they cannot be trusted. 
They are in some madness.









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they are in some madness
Re: Re: I know I have similar feelings -- Inis Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
Manincar ®

11/28/2017, 06:56:50
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They are in some madness


Inis, I love this phrase. It accurately describes the mental state of a convert. And it doesn't stop there as you suggest. We humans have a weakness for charisma and ideology it seems. 

Look at nationalism, politics, sports teams, rock bands, religion, corporate atmospheres, military, royalty and celebrity...the list goes on.

I think it is only fair to say that everyone is subjected to these types of pulls and influences at some point in their lives. It may have something to do with our craving for dopamine. Being swept up in a movement triggers those neurons to fire possibly ?

But it almost seems as bad as a pandemic at times, or maybe the Invasion of the Body Snatchers is actually underway ? Either way the KoolAid is available on every street corner.

Pick your poison 

On a more hopeful note, I am reading a good book called "A General Theory of Love" by three University of California Psychologists. It lays out a basis for how the human brain thrives on connection and community. A more benign and pleasant rationale for our misguided behavior perhaps.

cheers


  
  






Modified by Manincar at Tue, Nov 28, 2017, 07:15:53

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nice post
Re: they are in some madness -- Manincar Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lesley ®

11/28/2017, 23:41:29
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You are so right - there's an ism waiting to mug you on every street.  and it's almost like we want to be charmed.  well I think we do, we just don't want the bs that usually follows instead of the connection and community.

Pick your poison - I joined a bridge club and that's not too bad.  It's still kinda weird the way we like the game so much and so much emotion over it.  And enough connection to community to make you question if maybe you could do without it.  sorry.  I do like them most of the time.






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Re: nice post
Re: nice post -- lesley Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lexy ®

12/02/2017, 04:27:21
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I love Bridge , Lesley. My mother taught me many card games before I was ten years old. She was a stickler for " the rules " and often added the extra frisson of winning money.I have the memory of my whole family sitting round the table together, trying to win.

I'm not sure how this connects to my foolishness in becoming a premie  






Modified by lexy at Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 04:27:56

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Re: nice post
Re: Re: nice post -- lexy Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lesley ®

12/02/2017, 04:43:47
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oh good.  It is fascinating isn't it.  My brother sends me the bridge column out of the newspaper and the monthly magazine which i read from cover to cover.  

My favourite start to the day is breakfast on the verandah with a bridge conundrum to contemplate.

Much more fun than meditating.  






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That's a great post , Susan ! (no text )
Re: I know I have similar feelings -- Susan Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lexy ®

12/02/2017, 04:19:41
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Yes, I agree. Great post Susan . NT
Re: That's a great post , Susan ! (no text ) -- lexy Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
Kelly ®

12/02/2017, 07:13:00
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vulnerability
Re: I know I have similar feelings -- Susan Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
13 ®

12/02/2017, 07:03:38
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Looking for something in common that rendered us stupid enough to fall into a cult - I think it is simply vulnerability. We're all vulnerable more or less, in similar and varying ways at different times in our lives. We all happened to be vulnerable for whatever reason when we got seduced into the cult.

It doesn't necessarily mean we remain stupid or vulnerable, but it might do. I don't really feel any shame mentioning to people I was in a cult (what cult? it doesn't matter, just a cult). It's the same as saying some bad luck happened when you happened to be vulnerable. Just life...






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Re: vulnerability
Re: vulnerability -- 13 Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lesley ®

12/02/2017, 20:05:01
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"what cult? it doesn't matter, just a cult"

I'm like that too.  I'm not ashamed of it but I don't want to say which one, some people can be shocked at the guru aspect and want more dirt and I don't feel like dishing it up.  Particularly to people who lack the imagination to realise it could as easily have been them.  I still feel like the silver lining is in the exiting.

I'm proud to be part of this group - the ex-premies.   






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Re: vulnerability
Re: Re: vulnerability -- lesley Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
SuzyQ ®

12/03/2017, 04:54:26
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Interesting. 
I always say it was Prem Rawat, Maharaji, a guru. 
I think I'm warning them, not just for them but for anyone they meet in the future who is into him. Maybe they'll have a conversation with a premie one day
... and I guess I want to expose him. I want everyone to know he's a dick. 
If it comes up in conversation that is. and that is a big if. 
Sometimes it looks like it might nearly go there but I just don't feel like rehashing it again so I steer clear of mentioning it. 

who cares in the end, it was a process and sometimes I find i'm just talking about me and how I got here instead of listening.
 When I am having a conversation about me and the distant past and the illusions dispelled, mostly it turns into a talk about self belief and self empowerment. Focussing on the positive.
 
Some people look at me like it's obvious ( the deception from a guru, are you kidding me, like they worked that out in 5 seconds) and kind of laugh, but as you say vulnerability is one of those things that we all experience, there are various ways to be with it, probably easily broken down into personality types. 
The two extremes,in ways of coping, of which I think I am one, seem not to work too well - but we live and learn, if we're lucky. 
No need to judge myself anymore, that was all a big part of cult life for me and I'm feeling really free to have let that bit go to a large extent. 
If I catch myself I can grab the moment and just soften up on myself and accept the growth and learning that I'm in. 
I hope I continue to just keep growing like this, and more, even if at times that means I meet uncomfortable moments. 
The cognitive dissonance had me avoiding the uncomfortable truths staring me in the face.
 Therefore the feeling of marking time.

 It's like a bad investment, at which point do you let it go? I remember him saying 'it just gets better and better' I remember air head honchos saying the same thing, satsanging it to the max. drilling for dollars. That sentence alone probably kept me in the cult a few more years. 
Cos I'm not a quitter, maybe vulnerable and way too trusting of the wrong sort of people in the past.

 But I still have my good qualities and something good has come out of this, I've seen some of the shit coping mechanisms that don't work and I'm having a good time revising them. And what dya know? that DOES get better and better. 

The shadow of doubt I had going across my mind as he said that, self doubt - because I believed him. Eventually it came to my awareness

 His charisma? It really is dwindling, he can't hold it together, combined with the fade of the spell.
There is a classic furry freak brothers comic where the brothers are in an abandoned house where the chandalier falls down and it crumbles into a huge pile of cocaine. ( can't stand the stuff personally) but anyway, being a crazy comic and funny and all, they had a whale of a time and had picked up some beautiful women who were hitch hikers and all the drawings were beautiful and sparkly and they were buzzy and happy and excited and their ideas got wilder and wilder and THEN... it wore off and there were these cartoon dust sparkles falling through the air as the illusion evaporated. 
Then the women were scraggy and weird looking with missing teeth, the house was a dump, the car was a bomb and the land and trees were just dried out and uncared for and the brothers were depressed.

It was a bit like that really, a trippy dopamine thing, being in love. Obsessed. In a long distance relationship with a total narcissist.







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Re: vulnerability
Re: Re: vulnerability -- SuzyQ Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
lesley ®

12/04/2017, 02:53:53
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"..In a long distance relationship with a total narcissist."

worse really - a narcissist whom we believed we were ultimately responsible to.  Who could make the sky fall who could make us suffer for eternity.

When you fall in love all good sense goes out the window.  You drop your boundaries and make yourself vulnerable.  It's an essential achilles heel to have.  Gurus know how to take advantage of it.  I remember having a theory at one time that this is how the idea of God and religious groups got started in the first place.  (I don't know what I think at the moment).






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very good
Re: No rewind button -- Inis Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
snow-white ®

11/29/2017, 06:46:55
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"We were a bunch not too bright."
Re: No rewind button -- Inis Top of thread Post Reply Forum
Posted by:
Steve ®

12/06/2017, 10:06:41
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According to this article, most cult members are of above-average intelligence, well adjusted, adaptable, and perhaps a bit idealistic.




Related link: http://www.apologeticsindex.org/265-who-joins-cults-and-why

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