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...Does anyone else remember a question and answers at The Royal Albert Hall in London around 1980 when a female premie who had a baby ( it was the premie "baby-boom" days ) asked Maharaji whether it was best to breast or bottlefeed ? ( He laughed ,skirted around the question and changed the subject )
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Why would anybody ask him a question like that? That's disturbing. Because he's the "lord" and knows everything? Wow, that's wrong on so many levels.
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"Why would anybody ask him a question like that? That's disturbing. Because he's the "lord" and knows everything? Wow, that's wrong on so many levels."
He was young , Premiespouse ,and had three kids of his own already. Many young premies were pairing up ( following the master's lead ) and breeding.I suppose that premie thought that Maharaji could answer the question on every level...as all-knowing LOTU and as a young experienced parent. Maharaji called his wife ( Marolyn) the Hindi name of Durga Ji and she called herself our ( the premie's) mother ! So the parental role was encouraged ( Arti: " You are my Mother and you are my Father" ). There were premie kids everywhere. It was only natural after the repression and sexual tension created ( for teens and young twenties ) by the inhuman ashram system; actually it was only natural regardless of anything else! It was a good excuse to leave the ashram ( get pregnant ) though not without the whiff of scandal and possibility of some kind of Divine downgrading. As far as I remember ,that Royal Albert Hall prog. was the first questions and answers for years and years, and the absolute first for me ( I had only read Qs and As in " Divine" publications.)It may have been much earlier than I said as I get confused with the dates.In my naeivety I thought there would be sincere Qs and As and all my doubts and confusion would be dealt with. At the time I was astounded by the breastfeeding question but now I think ( feeling amused)....why not ask him? I thought the questions would be philosophical with answers that were truly meant to deepen our understanding but it was just the kind of disappointing rubbish I would get used to over the years ( and of course there was nothing to understand except that I had been hoodwinked). I left the programme feeling cheated ...but I denied my own experience and hung around for another 25 "what a let down" years . If anyone remembers this ( or these) RAHall programmes and can remind me when they were and what happened,and give their own reminiscences I would appreciate it.I had many huge doubts right from the start but always "left no room for doubt" in my mind as we had been told by the Divine Commandment. Lexy
Modified by Lexy at Fri, Feb 10, 2006, 13:10:28
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I remember at some big program in Miami, Maharaji bitched about all the kids he saw that day coming through the darshan line -- he made some derrogatory comment about premies having too many kids. It wasnt' long after that when kids were banned from programs. I have to say, I can recall doing security at festivals for darshan lines and seeing a lot of child abuse going on as parents dragged there sometimes frightened, always bored to tears, kids for a couple of hours in line to have them kiss the Lord's feet. I think they believed it was some kind of golden opportunity they should have whether they liked it or not. I know he was anti-choice, and I am aware of at least two ashram sisters who went ahead and had kids, and discarded the idea of an abortion because Maharaji had said he was opposed to it. If you look around the people who were REALLY in charge in the cult (not EV, but OGM and Maharaji's personal "incharge" people, I think it was always men). Mishler, Dettmers, Donner, etc.
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Lots of things he said alluded to that, and lots he did and who and how he surrounded himself. I think though I know a few exceptions to the abortion rule. I think I knew someone who had one because he advised it. And though its only rumor, Monica was forced to have them, abortions, not Rawat. Perhaps life is only valuable to him in the context of how it makes his own life easy or hard.
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In the cases I mentioned, it was an initiator relaying the information. When was that?
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I remember that during the Holi program in 1980 in Hollywood, Florida Maharaji commented on all the premie children present by saying there is a lot of propagation going on. Kabir
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That was probably the program. It was in that horrible arena in Hollywood, Fla., called the "Sportatorium" where they held cheesy wrestling events and those big clashes between trucks with the big wheels. Not sure what that's called. I was the community coordinator in Miami at the time, and pretty miserable. Maharaji seemed pretty miserable too.
Modified by Joe at Thu, Feb 09, 2006, 21:27:48
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At this program in Hollywood, Florida Maharaji did Holi in a baseball stadium. He also spoke there on a stage set up on the pitcher's mound, the famous "Sermon on the Mound". Kabir
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That was the same baseball stadium that the premies sold beer at a Bill? Seeger concert, to raise money so Prem could have a gold-plated pisser on his private jet. It was real fun, let me tell you. BTW -- did Rawat ever do Holi in the West after 1982? That was the last one I attended.
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His last Holi in the west was in 1983 in Miami. That was also the last time he gave darshan in the west outside of Amaroo and donors meetings. Kabir
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There was no Holi associated with the program in the Hollywood Sportatorium. The baseball stadium where Holi was held was in downtown Miami (Bobby Maduro Stadium, I believe) where the Orioles used to hold Spring Training. You're memory is somewhat twisted up with these two events. which happened at different times. FYI: In Hollywood, there was no airconditioning system, only swamp coolers. Rather warm. Also, that place accommodated crowds of two two there hours in duration (not 14 to 16 hours in duration, like our group). Therefore, Divind Light Mission overamped the toilet system and things were flushing right up through the ground outside the arena, causing an environmental and odor issue.
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The program was at the sportatorium in Hollywood, Florida and Holi was at the baseball stadium in Miami. These events all took place in April 1980. Kabir
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Funny that Joe - cos I remember Rawat saying that premie's kids were 'hand-picked by Shri Maharaji'.
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I recall hearing the Rawat kids breasfed until they were anywhere from 2-5 or so. Again an example of premie kids getting the short end of the tit...um...stick.
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I recall that Rawat always had premie/devotee servants (aka unpaid "slaves" , and one whose name I can't recall, was a fulltime slave for Marolyn with respect to Premlata. When Premlata was a baby, this premie slept outside Premlata's room and took care of her if she woke up in the night, so Marolyn and Rawat were not disturbed. I wonder if Marolyn also had a wet nurse? I wouldn't be surprised.
Modified by Joe at Fri, Feb 10, 2006, 12:47:50
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I heard all the kids slept in their parents room. At least first three. And that they had a sultan size bed ( never heard of that before or since ) and put little mattresses on floor so the kids could be near them. I heard the kids had bedroom but didn't sleep in them. This is something called "attachment parenting" and from what I heard the kids may have had lots of premies around to help but Marolyn was totally devoted to them , long term breastfeeding and all. This, since its what I think it really best for kids, I totally applaud to this day. Please don't tell me the one and only thing I thought they did right isn't true EITHER! we need a x rated person here cause I was not there. But I did help set up temporary residences in Miami before he had a house there. I am pretty sure I was told the kids slept in family bed with mom and dad. I always thought that is terms of how they parented the kids as little kids all I heard was pretty great stuff. Maybe Anth would know on this one. Betcha I am right on this one!
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I heard from several different people that Marolyn had full-time help with the kids and I recall hearing directly about the sister sleeping outside Premlata's door to respond so Marolyn could sleep and not have to get up in the night. Actually, Joy, if she is reading this, knows about this as well. Joy? All Rawat's kids had full-time nanny-types from age 0, and of course the premies considered it blissful service to take care of the Lord's kids.
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But one really doesn't negate the other. However, if there was a sister sleeping outside her room ( and that of many including myself would have thought greatest service in world) while she slept its possible that was some sort of unusual occurence because it isn't what I heard at all. We do need someone who was around to tell us which one of us is wrong or right on this bit of cult trivia. But as I said at the time I knew some of the people who were the nanny types and that sure wasn't what I was hearing. Still think I am right - notty notty boo boo
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Nanny premies were around and if Marolyn was getting a massage, nails done, exercising, recreating with the lord or whatever they were there. But my impression was the kids were never even left for a day( or more than a few hours) without her while they were small. I could be mixing this up with Princess Di?
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.....at the residence in Reigate.Maharaji was holding a kind of "Party" ( Hansi's fourth birthday ) in the Marquee. I was sent into the garden to try to find Hansi.He was quite alone with his mother and neither of them wanted to return to the marquee. She was totally NOT grand , quiet ,approachable and nice.They both seemed to be avoiding all the razzmatazz. Personally I doubt she ever had a "wet-nurse" !
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My impression of Marolyn was that she would have breastfed her own kids.
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......at that same "party" (Hansi's fourth birthday).....I remember seeing Navlata ( Raja Ji's daughter ).....it was a very long time ago but I remember her as being maybe 4 or 5 years old then.I think it was about 1981 yet on Navi's film biography she is claimed to be 26 yrs this year.Unless Raja had two daughters and I saw another one....puzzling....
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Yeh I remember that stuff. I remember him going on about how saintly Marilyn was (compared to the rest of us motely premie mums)cos she got up 4 am (or thereabouts) meditated for much more than the proscribed minimum of one hour and then breast fed the kids, did service all day, kissed the Lord's feet etc etc...
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Hi, I think Maharaji did the right thing at that time. With our 2 kids I surely spent too much time amongst tons of sheety dipers, hundreds of breast feeding mamas and the air was filled with the smell of sour milk. And the worst thing of all Maharaji on a screen in every dent and in every room from Kissimee, Rome, London, Genf....all around the world. Yeah making love was a trendy way to do probagation at that time. Honestly, if I would't be a premie at that time, maybe I would't have two sweet kids.
love...........wolfie
Modified by wolfie at Fri, Feb 10, 2006, 04:15:18
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