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Would you trade places with Prem Rawat?
Not even at gunpoint.
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with his lotus toenails(see link below). It will be a good money spinner
Related link: Divine body parts
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I'm a little surprised that premies can't already "buy" his toenail clippings and haircutting leftovers. There ought to be a hot market for those bits of trash. Maybe his manicurist and barber are saving those goodies for after he dies. Market speculating, in a way I suppose.
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I used to have some hair of his. There may be a very quiet market of this stuff. Remember charnam rit? It was "holy water" the kid was supposed to have dipped his toe into. We would drink it. UGH!!!!!!
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And didn't women who wanted to fall pregnant drink charanamrit that had been used to wash the Lotus Penis?
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"And didn't women who wanted to fall pregnant drink charanamrit that had been used to wash the Lotus Penis?"Ocker you must see "Coming to America" with Eddie Murphy (see at least the first 20 minutes)  )
Related link: Coming to America
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Actually...um...er...I still have 3 strands of Maharaji's hair that his haircutter gave me back in 1979 when I was still a foot-worshipping fanatic. We used to treasure all things Maharaji touched, including left-over food off of his plate (called prassad) which we UGH! ate. Divine food. I also have a small 1" x 1" square of plexiglass with his thumb-print on it in gold-leaf when he was fooling around with design ideas at DECA. I saw him do this in the design department and it was my job to clean up after him. Anyone interested in buying these call contact me at sylviecyn@yahoo.com">sylviecyn@yahoo.com. I'm not kidding. It's not going to be cheap though. P.S. These items have been carefully stored since 1979 in a jewelry case, within another air-tight box and rarely opened.
Modified by Cynthia at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 13:42:31
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'prasad' was so divine that the food remained indefinitely fresh and did not turn into rotten vegetables. Actually once Rawat dies he will probably not rot just like Yogananda http://www.self-realization.com/articles/yoga/kriya_yoga.htm
on the other hand as he's come with more power than ever before maybe he won't die until the whole world is practising His Knowledge and the way the premies are going with propagation he may never die.
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Thanks for the correction. As you know, I can get a bit churchlady-ish about spelling and grammar, but mostly for myself.
Modified by Cynthia at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 17:32:19
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but hey, if you can make a buck, what the hell.
The very last bit of memorabilia I had was a picture of the Prem when he was a boy with the turban around his head. I ended up using it in a little art piece I made. It's not like I was into doing this kind of thing, but if you were an artist in the 80s, I think you couldn't avoid making at least one piece of art with a porn theme. So yes, I did one, a collage, and somehow it just seemed like the right use for that last picture, so I incorporated it. It's not like it had some great significance and it wasn't even a very nice piece. Just a bit of fun on a rainy day.
The funny thing is that a bit later I ended up staying with a premie and working for him for a bit. I happened to have the picture with me, so I just hung it up. At first he tried to ignore it, then he got pretty mad and even ripped off the picture, to which I responded by protesting his desecration of my artwork and pasting it back. You could see that he was going through a kind of inner conflict about not wanting to appear to be uncool by being against freedom of expression while being bothered as hell by his holiest of holies being surrounded by vaginas and penises.
In retrospect it was pretty rude and disrespectful on my part, I mean I was staying in the guy's house, but in those youthful days I thought it was funny.
Yeah, okay, I still think it is funny.
But getting back to your devotional relics, why not try auctioning them on eBay. Now that would really be art. I wonder if you could get a link from the Andrea Cagan PIP Amazon page?
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Good story about your collage. When I was a teen (pre-cult) I made an entire collage on one of my bedroom walls dedicated to the Beatles. John was my favorite, although of course, Paul has always been the cutest. I just might the Rawat stuff up on Ebay, to see if I get any bites, but premies might think I've fouled their magic with my godless hate.
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You never know, those long term premies are getting pretty bent out of shape, ...might just increase the value.
Auntie, don't spose you kept your artwork? 
And all I did was use a copy of the Divine Times to line the kitty litter box.... didn't occur to me to worry about the fate of the pics in it!
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fraid I don't. It wasn't anything great. I threw it away at some point. Very eighties. It would have caused rather a stir here though.
Modified by aunt bea at Mon, Mar 19, 2007, 04:05:06
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oh well, maybe you can make a fresh one ... surely they're getting bored with the official darshan items, let's spice it up with some blackmarket gear.
Gold Leaf Thumbprint of the Lord. This priceless item shines undimmed - protected from the mists of devotion by a Himalayan cedar humidor, it has travelled the world.
And it has travelled to the depths of the human soul. The extraordinary price we expect this item to reach is due to the resonance it has achieved through being found and kept by Cynthia Gracie. (pause for gasps and shudders)
The artwork on the card of provenance is by Auntie Bea, our modern day Brueghel (oohs from the crowd...)
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When I was a kid I thought that Paul was the cutest too, but when I was old enough to learn that the songs were either written by Paul or John, John obviously became my favorite by far. I think I had a collage of Charlie's Angels once. In fact naming your favorite Angel used to be a hiring criterion in my agency, until the age group got so young that they didn't even know who they are. By the way, did you know that Jim once took part in a job interview process for my agency. Just let your imagination run wild with that thought. He more or less took it over.
But back to the topic. Well that is a thought. If your godless hate can have the power to suck the magick out of prasad, your something to reckon with. Suckin the mojo juice out of LOTU relics! Whoa! Imagine what it would do to the real live LOTU. And don't you go near that shroud of Turin. It'll be worse than bleach. All the more reasons for the premies to get that stuff out of your hands ASAP. Yes I think Leslie is right. Triple the price!
Hear that premies? it's downright deeVine service to get those relics into safe hands.
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I would tell all the premies that it is time they took responsibility for their own lives. That no one has the right to make decisions for another competent adult person and that they really can meditate, pray, take walks, ride horses or do whatever brings them closer to an inner peace, without being slaves to another person. I would sell all the assets and donate them to a worthy cause. I have always thought that someone should buy up an old hospital and turn it into a homeless shelter. I can think of a million and one different things that rawat could do for the betterment of humanity -- and he isn't doing one of them! So I would only trade places with him, if I could radically alter everything that he has done in the past...... and do everything totally different in the present! ==== added... Anyone who has the potential to do great good either through fame or wealth or position, and does not do it -- in my opinion, should be judged more harshly than those who have little or nor power or authority to help. Rawat could have done positive things for humanity - but he has not only not done good - he has done evil to others through his cult. He is a bad bad man.
Modified by Annie at Thu, Mar 15, 2007, 15:28:53
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>So I would only trade places with him, if I could radically alter everything that he has done in the past...... and do everything totally different in the present!< Absolutely - as Prem doesn't have the moral strength to clean up his own mess it's better he should be replaced by someone who does. - though I wouldn't fancy taking on that raddled body, it looks way past any hope of revival. N
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You would trade places long enough to do some good to those he has hurt and set the remaining premies, truly free. Nice thought!
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I would sell all the assets and donate them to a worthy cause... It's a good idea. I'd call it the Ex-premie Restitution Foundation. Non-profit, geared toward assisting anyone who gave a couple of decades to the creep and deserves to be repaid in hard cash. I'll volunteer to be on the board of directors.
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Just as there was no way I would've allowed myself then to think about what being Lord of the Universe must be like, there's no way I now want to think about what being a bloated parasite on other people's highest aspirations is like.
I was thinking about OTS's saying that Rawat ruined his life.
There were occasions in my life when I turned down opportunities to do things which would have benefitted me bigtime, but I chose to go with satsang service & meditation instead, so I entirely understand OTS' pov. I managed to claw something back from the lost years, sufficient to now give a wry laugh about it all, but I could get incandescent given half a chance.
Especially when I see one of the guys I didn't go into business with floating around the Med on a bloody great boat, whilst I'm still a working stiff living in a rented house.
I 'got out', in the sense of putting no.1 first, when I was in my '30's.........too late for the glittering prizes, but not quite too late for destitution. I believe OTS left it even later, so there isn't much on the plate for him.
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but I really mind all the lost time. That is something we can never get back. All those years following someone BECAUSE he claimed to be God, well, what a big fat lie. Stealing someone's money is bad enough, but stealing the years of someone's life - that is just criminal anyway you look at it!
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I mind the loss of material things. Of course I do. I probably have less of the material things in life than you do, though. 
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I was fifty years old when I tossed out Maharaji from my life as #1. One night, 25 yrs ago, I went to satsang instead of hanging around the res because I wanted something more peaceful than that scene. "Are you cra[z]gy-man?" I was asked by mahatmaji. I should have known something was not adding up a long long time ago. I'm aging uncontrollably, but that's natural. My plate is workable, but I missed out on so much. Thanks all.
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Exactly, my regret also.
There were occasions in my life when I turned down opportunities to do things which would have benefitted me bigtime, but I chose to go with satsang service & meditation instead, ...so I entirely understand OTS' pov.
......but not quite too late for destitution. I believe OTS left it even later, so there isn't much on the plate for him.
Those of us trapped with his faulty teachings, only a miracle can allows us to catch up so we can age without financial concerns.
I am blessed with good genes and I'm hoping thee hard work I'm doing will pay off so I too can make a decent, god living. One of my brothers is a electrical engineer and has a successful company in Argentina, my son is studying Computer Sciences, going for a master degree, but starting over in your lates 40s is not easy.
rawat's teachings KILLED so many good brain processes with their DO NOT LISTEN TO YOUR MIND ORDER/AGYA and one have to re-create them after exiting his trap. It takes a lot of work and determination. My age, the years wasted should have been using building a life and not having to start doing it a a later age. He took that from many of us. I left at the end of 99.
The game is not over: He IS responsible.
We are so much of a better person than he would only dream to ever be. Money is just money and can create lots of misery and he is an example of that. He got what he deserves and it seems it will continue to fall further down. I think there is no return for him. Outcasted from GOD's kingdom forever and ever! God loves HIS people but HATES evil ones. Rawat had chances to redeem himself and chose not to. His loss.
Best wishes to you PatD and OTS.
~Silvia~
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Only if I could keep my own bodymind.
It occurred to me the other day that in some ways he'd really got the worst of the guru/devotee dichotomy. It depends a lot on your own outlook of course so if wealth means a lot to a person they might think differently but at least back in the 70's Rawat was consumed with anxiety, he had an ulcer, he was getting drunk a lot and he had a raging greed for conspicuous materialistic technological consumption. Meanwhile premies are sharing satsang and giving away their wealth because they prefer the "spiritual life" and getting high on meditation.
Sure the life of a long term premie hasn't been all roses since those halcyon days and Rawat seems more relaxed these days but at least most of them are only showing the normal effects of aging and living comfortably whereas Rawat looks scarily disgusting.
I'm reading a book called Sham: How the Self-Help Movement made America Helpless ( http://www.amazon.com/Sham-Self-Help-Movement-America-Helpless/dp/1400054095)
it's great fun, even though it doesn't reveal a secret.
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One of the main reasons I keep reading here is that I am waiting for him to die. I mean his liver must be shot with all the booze he consumes. Don't hold your breath. Livers can be quite hardy. And mean, self-absorbed, narcissistic, selfish people don't tend to die young. I just went through the absolute best year of my life after my abusing father died in December, 2005. At first I had a hard time with it, lots of mixed emotions and grief, but within a few months, I suddenly became happy, light, and really free of him. It's been wonderful. I am so glad he finally died. I remember wishing my father would die when I was a little girl, because his abuse was so unbearable. So I had a long, long wait. He drank alcohol and smoked all his life until his dying day; he abused prescription drugs, and had terrible eating habits, not to mention all the hatred and abusiveness he spewed onto everyone in his path. He also had all kinds of other health problems, some from his time in WWII, and he managed to live to be 83!!! Prem Rawat lives a very, very, very good life. He's filthy rich, has adoring people to serve him all of the time, he never flies coach, and his life is probably quite stress-free. He answers to no one! Imagine that! That's how I see it from where I sit, managing my modest income and paying my puny bills. I just don't see him dying young. I would never want his life. He's so dumb he can't even string a few cogent sentences together to make a paragraph. No thanks, although I wouldn't refuse having some of my money back from him. He can never give back my time. That's the one thing that he has taken that is the most difficult for many exes to accept. I'm a late bloomer, too. But, I really try not to dwell on what I didn't do (I used to, a lot) and what I don't have (life can be difficult). I can't allow myself to be bitter and I don't feel bitter about my time as a premie, even though he took my time, goals, focus, dreams, energy, youth, and my love dishonestly. I can't get those back, so I'm try to look forward. What other choice is there? The time we premies gave was the most expensive price we all paid. Sometimes it hurts to think of my youthful dreams that slipped through my grasp, but I've learned (not from him!) that all the while it was myself who I was really meant to love so much, not him, so I am happy. Living well is the best revenge. Cynthia
Modified by Cynthia at Thu, Mar 15, 2007, 19:50:19
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Prem Rawat lives a very,
very, very good life. He's filthy rich, has adoring people to serve
him all of the time, he never flies coach, and his life is probably
quite stress-free.
No, look at "THE BEST PHOTO" "they" could find for the book cover! Stress free-life, Rawat? I disagree 100% with that statement. He is a complete miserable being, unable to really enjoy anything of what he ahs. Your first paragraph is more accurate to describe his present life. He is a very, very sick individual and sick people have a hard time enjoying life, as is possible to be enjoyed. No. He DOES NOT HAVE A GOOD LIFE, as he deserves it.
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He DOES NOT HAVE A GOOD LIFE... All caps is shouting. Please don't shout at me.
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...that's why you got sucked into a cult in the first place. You're too easily convinced!
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Not if a herd of wild mustangs dragged me there by my tongue! I guess you really don't want to trade places with him. But, check out this scenario: Prem Rawat is the last man on earth and you are the other remaining person. I'm thinking that if Prem Rawat were the last man on earth and I were the last woman, Prem Rawat would be one sorry (and horny) man. No mercy. He'd learn the real meaning of bitch.
Modified by Cynthia at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 17:39:38
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That's right and if you gave him an inch he would think he's a ruler. Also, I think the proper terminology nowadays for bitch is biotch.
Modified by nomorefootkissing at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 19:51:12
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Yes, Cynthia that was the appendage I had in mind You could sell your old relics on Ebay You can now donate via your ebay salesElan Vital is now registered as a charity on eBay. People selling items on eBay can, if they wish, donate a percentage of the sale price to Elan Vital. eBay donates a similar percentage of its final value fee to the charity too. MissionFish, which administers the donations, makes a charge - from 20% for smaller sums, down to 5% - depending on the size of the donation. MissionFish also collects gift aid, if applicable. When listing an item for sale, under 'pricing and duration' you choose the charity and state what percentage is to be donated. For more information on MissionFish see www.missionfish.org.uk. If you need clarification on any of this, please contact info@elanvital.org.uk">info@elanvital.org.uk . EV may occasionally sell items on eBay - if you'd like to see what these are you can do so by adding 'elan_vital_reg_charity' to your favourite sellers' list on eBay. _______________________________________________________________________"Life with Knowledge" ~ DVD Subscription 2007If you would like to keep up to date with Maharaji's events in 2007, you can subscribe and receive the DVDs of the events that take place throughout the year, in the comfort of your home. Subscriptions are annual and do not renew automatically, so if you were subscribed in 2006 and wish to continue receiving the DVDs in 2007, you must re-subscribe NOW. How to subscribe: Go to www.eurcomshop.com and click the icon "Life with Knowledge/Subscription 2007" Closing date for orders: 15th March 2007 __________________________________________________________________________ Zed
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I think I found the wrong Elan Vital product on Ebay. Maharaji could auction off his hair clippings and bath water and make some bucks on Ebay. Or signed copies of that photo calendar that was put out this year. I shouldn't give the cult ideas.
Related link: Elan Vital Bust Serum for Breast Enlargement
Modified by Cynthia at Mon, Mar 19, 2007, 08:14:13
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Good question/thread. Of course not! Some of us are very decent good people! Maybe everyone who posts here. I don't know you all personally. Many I met are nice decent people! JM, Robyn, Washington DC's ex-premies, Virginia's ex-premies, wonderful people!Poverty sucks, but riches? They can be a CURSE! Rawat is the best example of that. So much to worry about, risking PEACE constantly, paranoid, and this applies for all those who have it (riches) Benefits? many, who wouldn't want to have a loyal personal assistant? I would. Loyal PAID servants. Nothing wrong with that. But Rawat's life (note, I cannot call him Sir. or Mr., he doesn't deserve my respet YET) is so very pitiful. He got his little Malibu "kingdom"...so what? They are all so miserable and materialistic, ALL of them. He couldn't even offer WATER to those helping/serving him building it!!!! A PATHTIC BEING he is....and his minions... Very loving being: I met Marilyn, his wife in person, hangged around her for a while, I'm fond of her, but then, her integrity in my book is poor. She had to keep the family $$$together$$$ at all costs, even tolarating his mistress...afraid of Rawat's threats? What a sad soap-opera! Money can make life easier but cannot buy a good character, or right morals, or integrity to live it with. His fate is going down, and down. He made history: The boy who wanted to be "GOD" and never grew up....HIS CURSE...Nobody can misuse GOD's almighty name and get away with it. Many of us can understand for having read VERIFIED accounts of WHO HE REALLY IS that his justification and dellirum of greatness and "Napoleon complex" do not deny the truth: He is a very unhealthy, sick individual, and EVIL. Who would want to be him or trade places? Another psycho? His looks and poor mental and physical health,...who would want to trade places with him? Not me. I believed when I was 18-19 and got into the cult that material things do not bring happiness but a good character and moral principles and REAL wisdom do, and thought he was going to teach me how to do it...to later find out, he taught me poisonous stuff... in the name of liberalism....all that he told me to reject, he was doing himself. Building his riches and financial security lying to us, taking our monies...our futures away from us. He is the perfect example that power corrupts and temptemptions also. He can't get enough toys. He didn't listened to Bob Mishler's advice....now he is sitting in the human misery he created for himself and his people. Can you believe the photo on his book is the best "they" could do? Observe that photo and tell me what you see? A beaten down man. Tight, sad looking, and talking of PEACE and HAPPINESS.... Did we ex-premies do it? No, he did it to himself and his fall...he haven't landed yet. He's still falling.... I predict that his next photo probably will be in a coffin, with a down smirked smile as a sad clown. Nobody escapes TRUTH/Divine judgement. Each person is responsible for their behavior and cannot by any means blame it on a devil. Their choice and of that, I am 100% sure he is very worried about. Trying to put away one fire and starting 10 other ones... It satisfies me because I see GOD's fairness TO HIS PEOPLE... Rawat is getting what he deserves, the fruits of his work. He trapped himself and he cannot escape his fate, as any false prophet shouldn't be able to do. He committed a crime against humanity. Glad to be just, Silvia
PS: OTS. God's Blessings and Speed To You! LOVE.
Modified by Axis at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 10:04:35
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The capitol of Rawat's investments was at the expense of the premies. I can deal with the rich ones that throw a little his way...they want to waste their money that way it is their right to their own stupidity with their money. My problem is with what REALLY made him rich. That premies gave every single possession they owned. That he took trust funds, college funds, inheritances...he would take ANYTHING from anyone and then complain we were not surrendering our all in the seventies. These were the DECA years...where he risked the health, sanity...nothing was too much to ask of the premies in the quest for his jet. This is when he aquired the multiple multimillion dollar homes and the incredibly extravagant lifestyle. All while really really poor premies in darshan lines were being told to surrender and giving over their last ten bucks...I saw too many babies of surrendered moms, toddlers wandering around looking like they really were being raised as second best to Guru. This was what was most wrong. The ashram premies, the Deca premies, and the children of the not so mentally stable parents who really bought into the surrender it all mentality. It was a travesty. That is the foundation of his current fortune. If he is a successful investor now...that is how he got the capitol to invest. Playing God..demanding surrender...demanding every worldly possession. I think anyone who is as rich as Rawat owes the world a little charity. But I don't hold it against people who are "rich" and got that way honestly. I have something against criminals, mobsters, and cult leaders though.
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Thanks Susan and Axis too. This is the real truth about Prem Rawat. "My problem is with what REALLY made him rich. That premies gave every single possession they owned. That he took trust funds, college funds, inheritances...he would take ANYTHING from anyone and then complain we were not surrendering our all in the seventies. These were the DECA years...where he risked the health, sanity...nothing was too much to ask of the premies in the quest for his jet. This is when he aquired the multiple multimillion dollar homes and the incredibly extravagant lifestyle. All while really really poor premies in darshan lines were being told to surrender and giving over their last ten bucks...I saw too many babies of surrendered moms, toddlers wandering around looking like they really were being raised as second best to Guru. This was what was most wrong. The ashram premies, the Deca premies, and the children of the not so mentally stable parents who really bought into the surrender it all mentality. It was a travesty" And yet Prem Rawat & his organization proclaims ~ He's a self-made man. Thanks Susan. What you said is important and You nailed it perfectly!
Modified by nomorefootkissing at Fri, Mar 16, 2007, 22:21:33
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http://www.mikefinch.com/mj/art/md.htm Frem Mike Finch's web site. Question: Guru Maharaj Ji, what does it feel like to be Lord of the universe? Maharaji: What should I tell you about it? Question: Just what it's like. Maharaji: What it's like? Nothing. Because you are not in yourself; somewhere else; one with someone else. Question: How is it to be like a puppet? Maharaji: You don't know.... Do you? When you become Lord of the Universe, you become a puppet, really! Nothing else; not 'you'. Not 'I', not 'you' no egos, no pride, nothing else. One with humbleness; servant. Very, very beautiful. Always in divine bliss. Creating your own environment - wherever you go, doesn't matter. Like my friends used to play and I used to sit right in the corner of my ground and meditate (laughter). She wants to change places with me! I wish I could change places with everyone, and give one hour of experience to everyone! But it's not possible.
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